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License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Fri May 15, 2015 9:06 pm
by givememana
I've been using Little Snitch for a long long time. I think the product is well worth the price as is then and now. However the license upgrades are a scam.

If someone had told me I would be paying over $75 (USD, single license key) for basically a GUI firewall, I would say no right from the get go.
This is basically what is going on with license key upgrades.

From purchasing 1.x to upgrading to 2.x to upgrading to 3.x.

Fine I don't want to upgrade, well too bad I'd have to because the previous versions do not work.

You might as well just sell Little Snitch as a software as a service, that seems more honest to me than me having to keep purchasing upgrades even though I thought I had already bought it years ago.

And I am a programmer, that is why I paid for Little Snitch even though there's obviously ways around that. This has nothing to do with that but more to do with the business model and practices towards long time customers.

EDIT:
Honestly wanted to get my opinion out, so new here, and what do I see? Someone else only a few days ago feeling ripped off for the same reasons. viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9810

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Sat May 16, 2015 7:41 pm
by hagen
Just for perspective, there have been two paid upgrades in 10 years.

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Mon May 18, 2015 9:38 pm
by givememana
That's true. I don't know the exact amount of years, but yes it's been a long time.

Like I said, if you told me I would be paying $75 (USD, after the initial purchase and 2 upgrades) at the first initial purchase to have this software I would not agree to it. However, with the current pricing these years I've been slowly being suckered into paying that price because otherwise the software I did pay for will not work.

The current pricing model is in line with what Enterprise software use or OS software. And I'm sorry it doesn't seem fitting for Little Snitch which is just a GUI for an already built into OS X firewall.

I'll pay for the upgrade for a rewrite that was forced upon by the OS, but to add in extra features I don't care for? Too bad, I'd have to pay for it still.

Would you buy a game that forces you to purchase a upgrade for 'cosmetic' features otherwise the entire game doesn't work anymore?

Let's not kid ourselves, Obdev is milking their customers for more profit.

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Wed May 20, 2015 4:02 pm
by ratty
Dude, it's not that difficult, if you don't like the software or the price, then don't buy. They aren't forcing it down your throat, it's not a drug, if you think it's some kind of trick and you still keep buying it then you are just angry at yourself. LS has unlimited trial period, if it was just GUI for firewall why did you buy it the first time, and then twice again... People aren't gonna make app just with the features "you care for." If the features you care for don't amount to 25$ in your opinion then tough luck.

What if I told you that you have and would be paying thousands of dollars on hygiene products in your life, would you stop buying them? You cannot compare a fee over a period of time with the sum. Honestly try to use you brain, this isn't the USA where you have to tell everyone that microwaving your cat will kill it. In rest of the world people don't have time to tell and hear everything possible, no one's gonna walk you though your life telling you what to do. Learn to make decision for yourself, and take responsibility for them.

As for your beautiful game metaphor, you must be living in a cave. People are paying extra for remastered games (i.e. "cosmetic upgrade"), DLCs, mods. Hell, every year games like FIFA, COD, NFS are released with just "cosmetic upgrade", and DLCs which cost more than the game, and people buy it; because they want it. Do you want this app? Then stop bi***ing about it, otherwise go sulk in the corner with your "non-GUI" firewall.

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 12:27 pm
by raidersan
I have to upgrade with Mojave, I didn't expect LS to stop working and I feel cheated that the fix costs 25 euros in an upgrade license.
I have to bite the bullet for now but this is my last upgrade, nobody will convince me that it is a reasonable cost to keep it working. I don't want new features, I want it to work on current OS.

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:15 pm
by ctwise
raidersan wrote:I have to upgrade with Mojave, I didn't expect LS to stop working and I feel cheated that the fix costs 25 euros in an upgrade license.
I have to bite the bullet for now but this is my last upgrade, nobody will convince me that it is a reasonable cost to keep it working. I don't want new features, I want it to work on current OS.


You don't have to upgrade with Mojave, you can stop using the software. Or you can use an open-source alternative like Lulu (https://objective-see.com/products/lulu.html). If you want free, mediocre software with no guaranteed support, you have an option. If you want good, supported software, you need to pay the developers so they keep working on it. As macOS changes, they need to adapt the software to meet those changes.

As for the long-term cost... that's called a 'sunk cost'. It's a common fallacy to include that in your thinking. A car that retails for $20k doesn't cost $40k over ten years because it requires maintenance, gas and tires. The original cost is done and gone. The rest of the costs are the price of ownership. The world of software isn't stagnant. Just like you don't expect a car to run forever without maintenance, the same is true of software. And that maintenance costs money.

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 9:31 pm
by raidersan
Don't lecture me man, I sell software as well.When a sale is made there is an understanding that it won't stop working with the next OS update. We also charge if there is a sizeable change in the OS, but we always offer a minor version with no added functionality for a limited cost. LS is charging me 50% of the original cost just to keep it working. You cannot rationalise that kind of charge just for an update to keep it working.It is unethical and trying to tell me I should be happy about it is disingenuous.

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:40 pm
by ratty
@raidersan Is this really the worst thing that have happened you recently? Why so angry? Most business only care about making money, everyone knows that. Just let it be. Don't buy it again. It has caused you more resentment than it is worth it.

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2018 5:00 pm
by rxbike
Sounds like a lawsuit in the working, for all those who paid for at the upgrade because of mojave update chime in.
OX 10.xxx update should not require a license upgrade, it is not like this is a completely new OS from apple.
Objective development should reconsider their decision on enforcing an upgraded license for a product that was paid for and expected to be in working order. There were simply no communication to end users on the required upgrade and cost with the release of mojave.
I call fraud in the making

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2018 5:35 pm
by spencerj
I just created the account to say this,
It is not the right decision to make the customer pay again to use your product.
I am happy with ver.3, so let me use this one in macOS moJave plz.

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 2:02 am
by synestematic
Hi everyone,

is it certain that there will NOT be a LS3 version for Mojave ?
Maybe the developers need to finish it before releasing it.

Mojave is pretty fresh

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Sat Oct 27, 2018 1:39 am
by ryanic
So there are three types of people, the people who blindly side with the large companies and think it's fine for them to abuse us, the ones who will just pay because it's easier than fighting the abuse, or the ones who try to complain.

The problem is, companies like the one who own little snitch don't care, they know that there is sufficient numbers of people in the first two categories.

I would be interested in a large class action lawsuit against companies like this, making an example of them in the courts would help a lot of people in the future.

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2018 2:29 pm
by Stormer
yes, I think its very unfair to ask for a upgrade charge too, I upgraded my system and clicked on the link to upgrade, the old version was deleted and the new one installed. It wasn't until I restarted that I was informed I would need to buy an 'upgrade' to the software.

I should of at least be warned that there would be a 'charge', then I would not of installed the upgrade, also there's no 'support' link for old version of the software to re install and use your existing license code with.

I will not be upgrading!

I have already paid once for the software.

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:01 pm
by jms703
Devs should just move to a monthly/annual fee to cover the cost of development and support. I'd happily pay $24 USD a year for LS. That will shut these complainers up. It's unreasonable to purchase software 10 years ago and expect free updates for life. These devs aren't working for free and neither would any of you.

Re: License upgrades are a scam

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:18 pm
by FullOfCaffeine
I just upgraded to Mojave. I had the same feeling of being ripped off. They should have at least released a free upgrade to make the previous version work on Mojave. I don't have a problem with paying for software. But being put in a situation where I'm forced to, that's the problem. Not to mention it's simply unfair, I have no option if I want to continue using the software *I already own*.

This is also a problem around the culture around Apple and MacOS. While I understand there are underlying technical changes that might make software to stop working, it should be the exception, not the rule. It's ridiculous that every time I upgrade MacOS I'm expected to pay for updates for third-party apps.

Luckily I already use Mint 18.3 as my de-facto main OS (and I'm using OpenSnitch there, which works extremely well and is completely free).