Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

General discussions about Little Snitch
christian
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Re: Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

Postby christian » Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:22 pm

This is a known incompatibility with a third party driver and there is little we can do because it's of conceptual nature. Little Snitch works well with the mac as it is shipped by Apple.

We'll update our download and shop pages really soon (tm), and the new pages have compatibility notes listing the NVIDIA issue. The new pages just need the final review.

Regarding refund: We decide this on a case to case basis. Please get in contact with our support and describe your situation.

y2kplaya
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Re: Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

Postby y2kplaya » Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:33 pm

I would settle for a fix versus refund myself.

Pfeife
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Re: Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

Postby Pfeife » Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:19 pm

And why don't you use the old prooven code you use in V3 to render the Network Monitor Window in V4? At least if you detect, the system uses NVIDIA webdrivers? I wouldn't care, if it doesn’t look as fancy as the new one, if it works as in V3.

Well, would be a bit more coding on your side but pointing with fingers at Apple and NVIDIA doesn't help your customers at all. As there is no other application I'm aware of, that has the same issues with the NVIDIA webdrivers, I'd say your decision to code the Network Monitor Window this way is part of the problem.

Frankly I'm happy with V3 and don't care about any new features in V4. The real problem is that V3 is not compatible with High Sierra and V4 is not compatible with any Mac using/needing NVIDIA Webdrivers. Which means goodby Little Snitch with the update to High Sierra.

Sorry if I sound harsh but I find this "we screwed it but it is not our fault" really annoying.

christian
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Re: Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

Postby christian » Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:10 pm

We have not coded anything in any way which requires an additional driver. It's just that we use the map. It's a component ready-made by Apple and if you drop it into your UI, the app needs the GPU and thus the driver. As long as you don't open the map, Network Monitor displays well, even with NVIDIAs drivers (but the map is open by default, that's something we might change to make it easier for customers with NVIDIA drivers).

Now, the driver itself is not the problem, other apps can load it. However, in Little Snitch, we have activated a security feature which prevents loading of code which is not signed or signed by a third party. It accepts only code signed by apple.com and obdev.at. This feature also activated in apps which work with DRM, e.g. iBooks. You'll therefore notice the same problem in iBooks. We want to have this feature enabled because Little Snitch is security-relevant software.

BTW: I've heard that you may work around the problem by installing (or configuring?) a second graphics card supported by Apple, even if you don't use it. We cannot verify this here because none of our computers exhibits the problem, even with NVIDIA drivers. If you have any input on this, please tell us.

splifingate
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Re: Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

Postby splifingate » Wed Oct 18, 2017 7:54 pm

As an update to my/this situation...

I have installed a copy of High Sierra to another disk, installed LS 4.0.3 there and NM displays as expected (like it does on my 2016 MBP (/and/ as it does when disabling kext signing in Sierra)) without any intervention.

Apart from the known-issue with the flickering Map when scrolling/etc., NM in 4.0.3 is working :)

Regards, splifingate

christian
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Re: Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

Postby christian » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:18 am

Interesting. Is it possible that you are working with Apple's drivers on the other drive, not with NVIDIA's web drivers?

BTW: The flickering will be fixed in 4.0.4 (next nightly). It turned out to be an image filter in the inspector pane. If the window contains an other view with a filter, the map flickers. If you never open the inspector after a reboot, there will be no flicker.

splifingate
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Re: Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

Postby splifingate » Fri Oct 20, 2017 3:10 am

christian wrote:

"Interesting. Is it possible that you are working with Apple's drivers on the other drive, not with NVIDIA's web drivers?"

I am using the latest drivers provided by nVidia for 10.12.6 (16G29): 378.05.05.25f01

For educational purposes, I tried the aforementioned method of disabling kext signing (Recovery > "# csrutil enable --without kext") with placement of the (also-aforementioned) .kext, and was able to use NM again (w/Map).

I can definitely attest that I was using the web drivers from nVidia :)

Fantastic software you folks have made, Christian.

Regards, splifingate

christian
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Re: Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

Postby christian » Fri Oct 20, 2017 11:31 am

Ah, you're using this kext hack mentioned before. Yes, NVIDIA drivers will work in this case. It's just that we cannot recommend a hack, especially if system security must be weakened in order to use it.

splifingate
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Re: Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

Postby splifingate » Fri Oct 20, 2017 9:11 pm

christian wrote:

"Ah, you're using this kext hack mentioned before. Yes, NVIDIA drivers will work in this case. It's just that we cannot recommend a hack, especially if system security must be weakened in order to use it."

Just to be clear:

In my Primary install of Sierra 10.12.6 with System Integrity "enabled" for everything, NM in 4.0.3 does not display anything but the window outline.

I installed a separate copy of Sierra 10.12.6 to a separate drive to test the kext hack, and NM displays/functions as I expected (based upon how I see it work on my 12,1 MBP).

What I found interesting was that--this week--I installed a fresh copy of High Sierra to an entirely separate disk, installed the nVidia web drivers with System Integrity "enabled" for everything, then LS, and NM in 4.0.3 displays as expected (albeit w/flicker) . . . no modification of System Integrity, after-market kexts, etc. :)

christian
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Re: Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

Postby christian » Mon Oct 23, 2017 10:37 pm

Interesting. Maybe the NVIDIA Web Drivers were not activated for whatever reason? Or something has been updated so that the library signed by NVIDIA is no longer required?

splifingate
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Re: Little Snitch Network Monitor (v.4.0.2) displays nothing but window border in Sierra 10.12.6 (latest)

Postby splifingate » Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:29 pm

christian wrote:Interesting. Maybe the NVIDIA Web Drivers were not activated for whatever reason? Or something has been updated so that the library signed by NVIDIA is no longer required?


I do not understand all the voodoo, but I can personally report that the nVidia 378.10.10.10.15.120 (and .121) drivers in High Sierra have transformed my User experience into something that approaches Ideal Usability :)

I am working again, and it feels great.

Regards, splifingate


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